Lessons from marketing a legacy construction firm on its 100th anniversary (feat. Dana Galvin Lancour) (2024)

Reaching 100 years is a commendable accomplishment for any business and should be celebrated to the fullest extent. As Dana Galvin Lancour leads Barton Malow’s centennial marketing campaign, she joins us to discuss the challenges and opportunities in marketing a legacy construction firm with deep community roots.

In this episode of Spill the Ink, Michelle interviews Dana, Barton Malow’s VP of branding and communications, about the strategic planning behind the firm’s 100th anniversary. They discuss how Barton Malow structures its team to facilitate cross-functional collaboration, the firm’s forward-thinking approach to thought leadership and the importance of getting internal communications right. Dana also opens up about her 17 years working in construction marketing and explains how participating in the Society for Marketing Professional Services (SMPS) shaped her career.

Here's a glimpse of what you'll learn

  • About Barton Malow

  • Insights from Dana’s rich career managing and marketing Barton Malow’s legacy brand

  • Do’s, don’ts and ideas when planning your firm’s anniversaries and milestones

  • Why Barton Malow decided to capture its history with a digital archive program

  • How to encourage cross-functional collaboration across multiple offices, geographies and brand families while maintaining messaging consistency

  • The ways Barton Malow demonstrates its values (rather than simply talking about them)

  • Using thought leadership to advance your firm’s strategic business goals, including how to improve buy-in with busy subject-matter experts

  • The importance of internal communications, especially for geographically dispersed teams

  • How Barton Malow is integrating artificial intelligence into its work

  • Why making time to actively participate in professional organizations, such as SMPS, is a worthwhile investment

About our featured guest

As Barton Malow Holdings’ Vice President of Branding and Communications, Dana Galvin Lancour provides creative and strategic direction to the Barton Malow Family of Companies’ brands while overseeing a talented team of marketing and communication professionals across North America. She brings a vision that inspires her team to continually strengthen Barton Malow’s brand, reputation and unique approach to marketing Barton Malow’s services.

Throughout her 17-year tenure, Dana has reimagined the company’s marketing strategy, helping modernize and bring the enterprise’s marketing and communications efforts to the forefront of the industry. She helped implement an email marketing platform to design and optimize targeted campaigns, redesign the Barton Malow intranet and create a vision for the first all-employee conference.

Dana is a certified professional services marketer (CPSM) and a dedicated member of the Society for Marketing Professional Services (SMPS), acquiring the prestigious Fellow designation in 2013. She was appointed as President of the Board of Directors in 2022, where she plays a key role in ensuring the organization continues to positively impact marketing and business development in the industry.

Resources mentioned in this episode

Sponsor for this episode

This episode is brought to you by Reputation Ink.

Founded by Michelle Calcote King, Reputation Ink is a public relations and content marketing agency that serves professional services firms of all shapes and sizes across the United States, including corporate law firms and architecture, engineering and construction (AEC) firms.

Reputation Ink understands how sophisticated corporate buyers find and select professional services firms. For more than a decade, they have helped firms grow through thought leadership-fueled strategies, including public relations, content marketing, video marketing, social media, podcasting, marketing strategy services and more.

To learn more, visit www.rep-ink.com or email them at info@rep-ink.com today.

Transcript

[00:00:00] Dana Galvin Lancour: You don't want to break people's hearts. There's so much allegiance to an anniversary and especially [from] the people who have been at the firm for a really long time.

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[00:00:13] Announcer: Welcome to “Spill The Ink,” a podcast by Reputation Ink, where we feature experts in growth and brand visibility for law firms and architecture, engineering and construction firms. Now, let's get started with the show.

[music]

[00:00:31] Michelle Calcote King: Hi, and welcome to Spill The Ink. 'm Michelle Calcote King. I'm your host, and I'm also the Principal and President of Reputation Ink. We are a public relations and content marketing agency for B2B professional services firms, including law firms. To learn more, go to rep-ink.com.

Today, we're talking to Dana Galvin Lancour. She is Barton Malow's VP of Branding and Communications. Barton Malow is a 100-year-old general contractor with an expansive portfolio and range of service offerings.

They have 14 offices across the US and Canada. Dana is a highly esteemed and respected figure in the marketing world. She's the SMPS National President and an SMPS Fellow, just to name a few of her accomplishments. We're really excited to have her on the show.

Welcome.

[00:01:20] Dana: Thank you so much for having me, Michelle.

[00:01:22] Michelle: Yes, I'm really excited to talk to you.

Tell me a little bit about your career. You've been with Barton Malow for over 16 years. How did you end up in construction marketing?

[00:01:33] Dana: Well, like most of us, I didn't go to school to end up in construction marketing, but my undergrad is in marketing and communications. I also have an MBA. When I was in college, I was looking for an internship in a marketing department and was able to get an internship with Turner Construction in their local Detroit office. And really just fell in love with the industry and with the impact that the industry has. We do really cool things in this industry.

I live in Detroit, so we're definitely an automotive hub. While I like cars, it wasn't what I necessarily wanted to work on from an advertising and marketing perspective. I was lucky enough to get a full-time role upon graduation after working as an intern for about a year at Turner. From there, just continued to learn about the business, to learn about how to do marketing within the business. It's just been a joy ever since.

[00:02:35] Michelle: So you know construction then. You've been in it your whole career. That's great.

What I thought was interesting was that your title includes the word ‘branding,’ which you don't see a lot. Can you tell me a little bit about that?

[00:02:47] Dana: At Barton Malow, we have a family of companies. We're very cued in on our brand, what we say, how we look, and just continuing to put the Barton Malow name in the spotlight. We have an extreme focus on making sure that we have very consistent messaging across our family of companies. That's really the impetus for the role.

The great thing about our MarCom team at Barton Malow is that we're very well respected within the organization and our team members across the organization understand how important branding and marketing and communications are to the overall business. We're brought in as thought partners in a lot of cases. Branding is at the core of all of that.

[00:03:37] Michelle: That's huge. That's a huge accomplishment. That's a testament to your leadership, I'm sure.

Can you tell me a little bit about your internal team and how it's structured and what expertise you have in-house?

[00:03:49] Dana: I actually just celebrated 17 years with the company last week. When I joined Barton Malow, there was already a really great foundation set. I had a mentor, Cheryl Maybach, who was our chief marketing officer at the time, and had really set a great foundation for how we do marketing. There are practices and processes that we continue to this day. We've certainly grown since I have been there and the way that we do marketing has changed.

We have about 45 team members that serve the MarCom function across the company. We have the traditional marketing specialist roles. We also have a team that's dedicated to communications, both internally and externally, and really making sure that all of our general marketing materials are kept updated on a regular basis. We also have a very highly functional creative team that serves everything from graphic design to video. We produce about 99% of our video in-house. We have a pretty robust team that works on that. We're also blessed to have several people out on sites that are doing drone footage at all times. They're an extension of our team.

Certainly, we think of ourselves as an in-house creative agency, whereby we use consultants, but we use them at a minimum. Things like building the coding for our website, we'll use a consultant for that. We really are focused on managing our own brand, managing our own creative and our messaging.

Our MarCom team works very collaboratively across the family of companies. While people have distinct roles, there's a lot of cross-functionality and everyone's learning along the way. I think that just makes it a little bit better because we do feel like one team, even though we might be serving certain business lines, or certain geographies or certain markets, there's still this need to collaborate across the entire enterprise.

[00:06:06] Michelle: That's pretty impressive.

Tell me about thought leadership. Is that something that is important for your organization? Tell me how you're approaching it.

[00:06:15] Dana: Yes, thought leadership is certainly important to any organization. For us, we're focused on the thought leadership that's going to advance our business forward. Maybe not necessarily on the traditional markets or traditional geography, but really what are the topics that the industry is talking about? What are the topics that are most important to us?

Right now, for us, is really focusing on the future of the AEC industry. With technology coming at us every single day, and things like AI, we definitely believe that our industry is ripe for change, and ripe for efficiency and improvements in the construction process.

The types of thought leadership that we're looking at is how can we impact the industry? We're heavily invested in AI, we're heavily invested in transformative delivery models, and just things that can make the process better for clients, and make the process better for really everyone involved because there's still a lot of efficiencies out there for construction. Yes, we think of thought leadership maybe slightly differently. What we're really trying to do is differentiate ourselves through the process of utilizing those topics.

[00:07:37] Michelle: Through future, forward-thinking type topics, and being on the cutting edge.

What I see a lot in the industry is that a lot of AEC firms say, “Yes, thought leadership is important,” but they constantly run into the challenge of getting their SMEs to participate. There's that roadblock that they're regularly running into. Do you have that challenge? If so, what are some of the ways that you are able to move forward and to get your SMEs involved?

[00:08:08] Dana: We're not perfect. Like everyone, we have challenges. We have certainly some of the traditional challenges that other marketers in our industry face. I will say that when you find that person that's willing to partner along with you and do it, and when you use that as an example, it certainly perks up the ears of everyone else. A lot of times, we use our examples, and we use our success stories to help move other things along. I really just need one person to partner along with me.

Again, I will say, we have a great thing going at Barton Malow in that our operation team members, the SMEs that we work with, they do really enjoy working with us, and they see the value that we bring. We really focus on helping them and understanding that they have a lot of stuff on their plate, right? Maybe being a subject-matter expert probably doesn't make the top five, maybe not even the top 10. What can we do to prepare them? What can we do to set them up for success and to show them, like, "Hey, you can do this. We just need this from you, and we'll help you be successful." I think that's really key for any marketer in our profession is thinking about the person on the other side and thinking about all of the balls that they're juggling and how can we help them through the process so that we can get more business and we can continue to be successful.

[00:09:48] Michelle: Yes, I preach that a lot. Make it as easy as possible for the SME. Don't go into it asking any questions that could have been Googled upfront. Take 20 minutes of their time, get every bit of information you need out of that one phone call.

At my agency, our common phrase is coalition of the willing. Find that coalition of the willing, get a success with them. That's our joke internally. It's exactly like you said, find that success and then demonstrate it.

The other thing I saw [is] you guys that you are talking about things like corporate social responsibility and DEI, tell me about how you are approaching that from a marketing and brand perspective.

[00:10:34] Dana: Corporate social responsibility and DEI are definitely popular terms that a lot of people are using today, but at Barton Malow, there are things that we have been working on that now fall into these buckets, but things that we've been doing for pretty much our entire history.

Our vision, our core purpose at Barton Malow is to positively impact people through the projects that we build in the communities that we serve. That is something that from our founding has been really important that we have standards of what we will build and what we won't build.

We very much believe in giving back to the community. We have a Barton Malow foundation that's actually celebrating its 70th anniversary this year. We have been really focused on the human element, the community element of building pretty much since our inception, if you read about our founders, Carl Barton and Arnold Malow. While DEI and corporate social responsibility is very important, we don't always necessarily use those words. We really focus on the work that we're doing and how we're doing it.

We have a very active community engagement team. We do something called Barton Malow Bootcamp in areas across the country where we're bringing students and generally individuals, 18 to 24 years old, who are looking to build their careers. We're trying to showcase what the possibility is in the construction industry. That's a program that we've been putting on for several years. We're working in all of our offices with minority and diverse suppliers, and really helping them through the procurement process and showing them what the opportunities are on our projects around the country.

Then from a corporate social responsibility standpoint — which there's a lot of overlap and there's a lot of different definitions out there — but focused on sustainability and lean practices and talking about what can we do better? We have a team that is very focused on how to be more efficient, how to be more thoughtful about the environment. While we know that we can't solve it for the entire world, what can Barton Malow do through its 14 offices and 3,500 people to make the world just a little bit better?

[00:13:12] Michelle: The big thing I really want to talk to you about is this is your 100th anniversary year.

First, let's talk about when did you first start planning? Because, I looked at a lot of things you did. You had a Thanksgiving Day parade float. You have a dedicated website. You've got the heritage page, the videos. You've really done it. Tell me, when did you start planning this?

[00:13:36] Dana: I would say we formally started about two years ago, but the really cool thing–

[00:13:44] Michelle: That's not long for that much work. I would have thought longer, honestly.

[00:13:50] Dana: The really cool thing is 12 years ago, Ryan Maibach became our president and CEO. Ryan's family is the family that has the majority ownership of Barton Malow. He became president at a time that it was very early on in his career. It was a little bit unexpected, I will say, in terms of the timing. The really cool thing is from the beginning, he established a BHAG for us that was tied to our 100th anniversary.

[00:14:22] Michelle: Big, hairy, audacious goal, in case anybody doesn't know what a BHAG is.

[00:14:26] Dana: Thank you.

It was to double efficiency and provide a value proposition that was the envy of the industry by our 100th anniversary in 2024. Along the way, we had established strategic objectives to get there. In some ways, we've been working on the 100th anniversary for the last 12 years. From a marketing perspective, we had a wish list going on. Then about two years ago, we started getting really serious, because I will tell you, people have been forwarding me ideas and I've been collecting everyone's wishes pretty much for the past 12 years.

We worked to establish a vision for our 100th anniversary and what were the goals that we had in mind. What did we want to achieve through our 100th anniversary? We certainly had a long list of everything from having an art piece done, doing a book, doing a website, doing this, doing that.

We did work with a company called the History Factory, which is a creative agency that specializes in legacy celebrations. It was good to have a third party, I will say, in this instance, because there's so much passion within the firm about what we wanted to do. They really helped us like narrow our focus because you can't do everything.

We had a set of target audiences, we had a set of messages, and we had a set of goals that we're working to do all of the things. Yes, we kicked it off with a parade float in the Thanksgiving Day Parade, which I know a lot of people know about Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade, but the Thanksgiving Day Parade in Detroit is actually broadcasted to 169 markets nationwide, and it is one of the longest established parades in the country.

It's actually celebrating 100-year anniversary. We've been big supporters of the work that they do beyond just the parade. They're really a community organization for the city of Detroit. It was an opportunity for us to really give back to the city where it all began. It was just a really incredible design process where we talked about what we wanted this float to look like, how we wanted it to serve our firm, as well as the industry, and really give a nod to the trades. The centerpiece of our float is a representation of all of the trades that are involved in the building process. We know we wouldn't be anywhere without them.

[00:17:07] Michelle: Oh, what a cool way to honor the trades.

[00:17:08] Dana: Yes, we are the largest contractor in the state of Michigan. That was very important to us.

Other tactics that we're taking, we launched a website dedicated to the hundredth. We have a centennial video series. We're doing a series of celebrations this fall for our team members around the country, and then the latest thing that I'm really excited that we're working on right now, we're doing a legacy tour where we're building a museum on wheels.

It's a 42-foot-long trailer and it's full of archives, it has digital boards, it has video boards, and we're going to be taking that to our job sites around the country so that we can share and celebrate the anniversary with our project teams and with our trades. Even with clients to share with them the history of Barton Malow. That's coming this summer and we're really excited about it.

[00:18:06] Michelle: Yes. That's a great way to integrate with the employees on the job sites, too, rather than it just all come from the headquarters.

You mentioned a book. Is it just like a coffee table book of major milestones and projects?

[00:18:20] Dana: We actually took the book off the table. That got nixed in our process.

[laughter]

[00:18:26] Michelle: With the website, is the website just a collection of milestones and the story of the company? What were you trying to accomplish with things like the website and the videos?

[00:18:38] Dana: We dug deep into our archives and actually used this opportunity to build a formalized archive program because just like everyone else, we've collected a lot of stuff along the way and we had just files and boxes and all kinds of things. We now have a digital archive and we actually worked with History Factory on that. The website is surfacing the stories from very early on. It's surfacing stories about our people and our projects and, certainly, the communities that we've impacted.

We're putting new content up about every other week. The content is not just stories, it's also video. I know that our website consultant was a little concerned at first and we said, “Well, we're not going to have everything ready right away. We want to build this website along the way.” They were like, “Wait, what?” It's a really cool opportunity to be able to surface content in a timely fashion and talk about things in parts of the year where it makes sense.

Probably the latest example [is] in a couple of weeks, Detroit is hosting the NFL draft and we built Pontiac Silverdome, which was one of the first stadiums that had an inflated roof. We're going to be launching the podcast and the story about the building of the Pontiac Silverdome in a couple weeks in conjunction with the NFL draft, which is just a fun way to recognize what's going on culturally in real-time, but also look back at where we've been.

[00:20:18] Michelle: Now you're obviously in the thick of it, but any advice for other marketers who might be approaching a history milestone in their firms? Is there some advice you would give?

[00:20:29] Dana: Yes, I do think starting early is really important because as awesome as it was that we started a couple of years early, I do have some sleepless nights still right now where I think about what still needs to be done and where we are. Our team is doing an incredible job, but it does come in hard and fast. I would say planning really early and I think establishing a vision or a set of goals because like I said, everyone has ideas and everyone wants to see something.

I will say that people are coming out of the woodwork with, "Oh, can we do this? Can we do that?" Having established goals where you can say, "Hey, we're going to do this and this is why," and being able to explain the process and what you're trying to accomplish is really important because you don't want to break people's hearts, and there's so much allegiance to an anniversary and especially the people who have been at the firm for a really long time, communicating that vision early on, which is something that we did, it just helps in the overall process and it just helps you really streamline what you're trying to accomplish.

Then you don't have to do everything. Like I said, we had a long list of things that we wanted to do and there's a lot of things that didn't make it. The book is one of them. In fact, the other day someone said to me, "Oh, are we doing a book?" I said, "No, we're not." They're like, "We're not?" Then I said, "No, but here's all of the other things that we are doing."

[00:22:08] Michelle: Other things. Yes, exactly. You can't do everything.

I'm going to go back to your team. Of the 45 people, are proposals part of your team? Is that a significant portion or is that handled by another department? How big is the proposal part of your team?

[00:22:24] Dana: The proposal part of our team is a good majority. I would say it's probably a little over half of the team is focused on proposals. What I'll say though, too, is hey, I was a marketing coordinator back in the day and I remember what it was like to be on a proposal treadmill where you're just churning out one after another. That's not the department that I wanted. That's not the brand of MarCom that we do at Barton Malow. We're very particular in our go-no-go process. We're very focused on making sure that we are pursuing the right work. So we want our marketing team to have opportunities outside of proposal development and they do.

Now, I will say, I have some team members that they love doing proposals. They love the pursuit process. That's great. We need those people. We also want to expose our marketers to other communication strategies. We have a lot of branding plans going on at any given time where we team up marketers and communication specialists and creative specialists to work on a branding plan, either for a particular project or for a particular market or geography, so that they can get exposed to things beyond just proposals because we all know that it's definitely more than just the proposal.

[00:23:50] Michelle: Yes, absolutely. That helps them understand what they're doing from a wider strategic perspective. I think that can only help them in writing proposals.

Tell me about internal communications. Is that handled by your department? Tell me about your strategy there and your tactics?

[00:24:09] Dana: We do handle internal communications and it is definitely a large focus of our communications department at Barton Malow, as well as I will say the marketers because a lot of the marketers serve a dual purpose, especially in our offices. At Barton Malow, our goal is for people to know what's going on inside the business before people know what's going on outside the business. That is really something that has guided us, especially over the last 12 years.

When Ryan first became president, I was a marketing manager, but I was doing a lot of communication work as well. We were a very small department at the time. He asked me to go into a purely internal communication role. I said no to him twice. Then he said, “No, this is going to be your job.” Internal communications is one of his priorities as the CEO of Barton Malow.

It was an amazing opportunity for me because they actually put me in HR for a while. That really helped establish what we wanted our internal communications program to be. While internal communications doesn't sit in HR any longer, we partner really closely with HR and with our HR business partners to ensure that our internal messaging is very consistent, to ensure that it has standardization, that we're using similar tools.

I'm grateful for that experience. I think it's just helped us build an internal comms strategy that is really– We have really great team member engagement scores. We do a net promoter score twice a year. Our net promoter score generally ranges right around 75. For anyone who knows anything about net promoter score, the range is negative 100 to positive 100. When you're in the upper quartile, you're probably doing something pretty well.

But yes, we do a lot of internal meetings, both online as well as in person. We have a very active intranet site. We have messaging going out internally on a weekly basis that our team manages. I would say we might even do more internal communications than external communications because we know that if you're communicating appropriately to your team members internally, they're going to carry it out that message externally. That's been successful for us through the years.

[00:26:51] Michelle: That's a fascinating point and something that I'm seeing with one of our clients where internal is the bigger lift and so, so important, and especially the more geographically dispersed.

How do you meet the challenge of communicating with employees on job sites, especially employees who might not be sitting at a computer? Are there special techniques or technologies that you're using? Is it paper, text? Is it these visits that you're doing? What are some of the things you're doing there?

[00:27:22] Dana: It's a little bit of everything. We do have a very large trade population that we're always trying to communicate with. We do have a quarterly trades newsletter that is purely focused on the trades and what is important to them. We also have a number of trades leaders that we utilize in our communication. If we need to get a message out fast, we will engage that trade leadership network and build communications that they can take out to the field and deploy very quickly.

Then I will say that visits from our leadership go a really long way. Our leadership loves getting out to the job sites. We've done peer group meetings, we've done just a series of leadership visits to places so that we can continuously connect with our team members. There is just a lot of pride in the work that they're doing. When you come to them, they love that, and they love showing off the work that they're doing. For our leadership, they love walking the job sites because they used to be there. It feels like going home.

We deploy a lot of different methods. I don't think it's one magic bullet. I think it's all of these things.

I'll also say we have a very active social media presence, Facebook, Instagram and LinkedIn are our three main focuses. I think that is as much of a connector of our team members and the trades and the trades families, and our team members' families. It's as much of an internal communication tool as it is an external tool.

[00:29:07] Michelle: I have two more questions.

AI, is that something that you're focused on using? Is your team experimenting with AI? If so, tell me how that's going. Is that a priority?

[00:29:20] Dana: I definitely think it's a priority. It's not just a priority for our team. It's a priority for Malow right now. Our entire enterprise is going through a series of pilots with different AI tools. I would say there's a large chunk of my team that are involved in that pilot in some way, shape or form.

I will give a plug for SMPS. They ran an AI.AEC session, and they're doing another one very soon. I think they're going to continue to do it. We sent a chunk of our team to that. We got a head start on what all is possible.

At this point, our team is utilizing AI on a daily basis, especially as it relates to the written form. We're using Copilot in our firm as well, which is helping us surface our files or surface information from all parts of our network right now. It's a really powerful tool. I think our vision for it at Barton Malow is that AI is not going to replace humans, but people need to know how to use AI. People who don't figure out how to use AI will be replaced. It is a tool that is not going anywhere, and it's going to help us all be more efficient in our jobs. I personally love it. It helps me every day.

[00:30:44] Michelle: Yes, absolutely. My last question was going to be about SMPS. Obviously you're a fan. You're the president right now. Tell me a little bit about how SMPS has impacted your career. If people [listening] aren't involved, a little bit about maybe why they should get involved.

[00:31:03] Dana: Yes, SMPS has definitely been a huge part of my career. I think I joined in 2003. It's either 2002 or 2003.

I think for anyone who joins SMPS, the real key part of it is getting involved either with a committee or with a board. What I love about it is it gets me out of my day-to-day. It exposes me to others who are doing similar work. It allows me to hear their perspective on it and hear how they're doing that work. Then it's just given me that outside network of folks that I need to bounce ideas off of, to commiserate with, to learn from.

There's so much knowledge and talent in SMPS. I think the folks that are involved just continue to elevate their game, which in turn helps me elevate my game. I will say in the darkest times during COVID, it was the group of people that I could turn to that really helped me through it because we are all trying to figure out how to communicate internally during this thing that had never happened before. I have a number of friends and some of them worked for my biggest competitors, but it was a time where I was like, "What are you doing? This is what we're doing. How are you handling this?" because it was such an unknown time.

For anyone looking for a network of people that can just really help them do their job better, I can't say enough good things about it. Again, it's about getting involved, learning, meeting people, spending time together, and it's really an investment in yourself and your career.

I know a lot of people will say, "Hey, it's so hard to balance my job and balance being part of an organization." It is a hard balance. I'm not going to say that it's not a hard balance, but I think it's so worth it in the end. I know that I wouldn't be in the role that I'm in today if I didn't experience SMPS to its fullest extent because it's just made me a better professional.

[00:33:16] Michelle: Yes, 100%. What I love about organizations like that is seeing competitors being so helpful to each other without giving away proprietary details, but really just coming at this, we're all in this together and helping one another. I've always enjoyed that about organizations like SMPS.

Thank you so much. It's been a really great conversation. I've really enjoyed it. We've been talking to Dana Galvin Lancour of Barton Malow. If anyone wants to get in touch with you, maybe talk about SMPS or talk about this 100th anniversary campaign, what's the best way for them to do so?

[00:33:52] Dana: Yes, connect with me on LinkedIn, shoot me an email. I will say probably starting with LinkedIn is probably the easiest because I never know what our email filters are going to do. I love talking about all things marketing, SMPS, the industry, and would welcome it anytime.

Michelle, thank you so much for having me. I'm honored and it was a pleasure talking with you.

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